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01/24/2006
Animals
A society’s morality or humanity is often measured by the way people treat criminals. (Dostoevsky? “..a society should be judged not by how it treats its outstanding citizens, but by how it treats its criminals.”, I did not do much of a search for the right quote.) Some say society deserves the criminals it gets. Another way humanity can be measured is by the way humans treat other animals. We call ourselves humans to distinguish ourselves from animals but we are all animals, depending on one’s theories of the origin of the universe. That’s obviously another subject but relevant here.
Yesterday, after observing many times that people walking dogs on a leash often have a big stick with them that is not being used as a walking stick, I wondered aloud if this was used to beat the dogs or perhaps quickly push them away from the chaotic traffic that is on the road. The answer I received was “They don’t beat the dogs, they just hit them to train them”. Needless to say I responded that it was one in the same to me. Beating and hitting are the same, whether it is for the purpose of training or punishment. Often punishment is used for training so it is merely the way one looks at it. For the dog, the pain and fear of being struck are the same. (Witness what dogs do when they see an owner’s arm go up in the air.) Sometimes the dog’s reaction is mixed with confusion if the dog is randomly punished/beaten/hit, whatever you want to call it, since dogs are relatively intelligent animals and can connect certain behavior of the human with certain behavior of their own.
As expected I responded that dogs can be trained without physical punishment but it takes patience, time, effort and understanding of canine behavior. Dogs after all do things for reasons-dog reasons-and we as the slightly more intelligent animal, can learn from that and use this to train them to modify their behavior, i.e. not taking food from the dining table. Often all one needs is repetition, consistency and the proper alpha tone of voice. Humans often lack consistency and that’s where the failing is, not with the dog.
I was then told that people also throw stones at dogs and harass them in other ways. (See another blog post about this, link is below. Apparently it is an instinctive reaction, likened to a sport to throw rocks, even bricks, at dogs.) I was surprised to hear this as I have only seen street dogs treated indifferently or sometimes I spot someone giving a biscuit to a stray dog hanging out by the tea stands. Dogs sleeping in the middle of the street are not afraid of people or cars. They are comfortable because of their experience of not being hurt. If they had experienced pain or fear, they would respond accordingly.
As an animal lover, I thought I’d include a quote, from a book Yitzy read and I have yet to finish as it depresses me so, that is topical and more so on my mind given what is being done and what may yet be done in response to bird flu. Something to think about:
“The care of animals brings with it often complicated problems of economics, ecology, and science. But above all it confront us with questions of conscience. Many of us seem to have lost all sense of restraint toward animals, an understanding of boundaries, a respect for them as beings with needs and wants and a place and purpose of their own. Too often, too casually, we assume that our interests always come first, and if it’s profitable or expedient that is all we need to know. We assume that all these other creatures with whom we share the earth are here for us, and only for us. We assume, in effect, that we are everything and they are nothing.
Animals are more than ever a test of our character, of mankind’s capacity for empathy and for decent honorable conduct and faithful stewardship. We are called to treat them with kindness, not because they have rights or power or some claim to equality, but in a sense because they don’t; because they all stand unequal and powerless before us. Animals are so easily overlooked, their interests so easily brushed aside. Whenever we humans enter their world, from our farms to the local animal shelter to the African savanna, we enter as lords of the earth bearing strange powers of terror and mercy alike.
Dominion, as we call this power in the Western tradition, today requires our concentrated moral consideration, and I have tried in the pages that follow to give it mine. I hope also to convey a sense of fellowship that I know many readers will share-a sense that all of these creatures in our midst are here with us, not just for us. Though reason must guide us in laying down standards and laws regarding animals, and in examining the arguments of those who reject such standards, it is usually best in any moral inquiry to start with the original motivation, which in the case of animals we may without embarrassment call love. Human beings love animals as only the higher love the lower, the knowing love the innocent, and the strong love the vulnerable. When we wince at the suffering of animals, that feeling speaks well of us even when we ignore it, and those who dismiss love for our fellow creatures as mere sentimentality overlook a good and important part of our humanity.
It is true, as we are often reminded, that kindness to animals is among the humbler duties of human charity-though for just that reason among the more easily neglected. And it is true that there will always be enough injustice and human suffering in the world to make the wrongs done to animals seem small and secondary. The answer is that justice is not a finite commodity, nor are kindness and love. Where we find wrongs done to animals it is no excuse to say that more important wrongs are done to human beings, and let us concentrate on those. A wrong is a wrong, and often the little ones, when they are shrugged off as nothing, spread and do the gravest harm to ourselves and others.”
From Dominion: The Power of Man, the Suffering of Animals, and the Call to Mercy , by Matthew Scully, pp.xi-xii, 2002.
Yes, I went a little overboard but you can always change the channel or in this case, click to another website. Or read more about the treatment of dogs, specifically Chennai, in a post from January 23rd on http://vee-jay.blogspot.com/ Click on "A Puppy's Last Moments".
13:15 Permalink | Comments (10) | Email this
Comments
Wonderful post Esmerelda. Vee Jay has a similar post that you might wanna check out http://vee-jay.blogspot.com I don't think people realise the huge responsibility that they take on when they get a dog.
Posted by: Uma | 01/24/2006
Thank you Uma. I read it. People also forget the responsibility they have to life in general when they operate vehicles as if they have the only vehicle on the road or that they own the road and anyone who comes in the way simply better watch out or else. I'll put the link in the post. Thanks.
Posted by: esmerelda | 01/24/2006
Coming from meat eating americans, this is indeed funny. Yeah, we might mistreat a few dogs, but slapping is not the same as killing...I don't have to tell you what KFC does to chickens.
And who is to remind u about the bisons ? Where are the bisons and yeah the dodos...
Huh...n u preach about Indian mistreating dogs. Just that KFC does it indoors, in their factories.... Really funny u people...
I cannot but quote a famous hindi dialogue
"Jin ke ghar sheeshe ke hote hain, woh doosron ke gharon pe patthar nahi maara karte"
Lest you forget, India is the only country with a large population which is vegeterians...these veggies might throw stones at some dogs or hit them with cane..but they are not going about consuming a pig/a cow/ a chicken on a daily basis..three lives saved per day, right there.
yeah u r right "A society’s morality or humanity is often measured by the way people treat animals( not just pet dogs)"...there is more to animals than dogs....which includes chicken, pork, beef et al
Posted by: Anonymous | 01/24/2006
Anonymous-
Firstly, if you read our 'About Me' page you would know that we are from New Zealand ;) .
Secondly, you're right that Americans eat meat. And not only that but Americans 'farm' their meat in ways that is staggeringly inhumane. They pack as many animals as possible in tightly confined ways, force them to eat unnatural types of food to get them as fat as possible as quickly as possible and also shoot them up with antibiotics all in the pursuit of the cheapest meat possible. So on this point I think it is great that you attack us on this point because Americans should be criticised often on the way they treat animals. You're right.
But, please know that I am a full vegetarian and that I do not eat any meat whatsoever because of the above. In fact I do not eat meat for three reasons: The practice of eating meat is
1) Not good for the animals
2) Not good for the planet
and
3) Not good for Me.
So, Mr. Anonymous: Do we still have no right to bemoan the poor treatent of animals here in India because of the poor treatment of animals by our countrymen? Or does my decision to be a vegetarian allow me enough of a high horse to pass judgement in comfort?
Posted by: Yitzy | 01/25/2006
Anonymous, you have a typical defensive reply. Not looking at the content of the comment but only attacking the nationality, origin, etc. of the person making it does not make constructive dialogue or commentary. It makes one simply dismiss the comment as one sees it is written perhaps in anger that has overcome the idea. Attacking a person's background, often stuff that does not matter re: ideas, of the speaker, is weak argument and a non-argument at that. Is the fact that I eat fish maybe 2x a month make me unable to merely comment about my ideas about the suffering of animals? The fact that I come from a country that consumes way too much by many cultural standards, make it impossible for me to comment? Is pure objectivity what you are seeking? What is objectivity? You will not find it anywhere.
Your Hindi quote about not throwing stones is interesting and used in many cultures but no one is casting stones here. Your "u people" language also indicates prejudice. I cannot tell you how many times I have heard that exact language in NYC when people, not whites for that matter, have denounced me, simply for being of South Asian origin or my religion. This always came from an immigrant himself also from a developing country. Thanks for your comment.
Posted by: esmerelda | 01/25/2006
Anon come on let's not pretend once again that all the evils of the society exist only in the west. Are you saying that a Westerner cannot be as compassionate as an Indian about animal welfare just because a lot of his/her fellow countrymen eat meat? Let me tell you in the country that worships Cows we send scores of them to death once they stop yielding milk. Probably not much differnt to the west. When it comes to dogs, I hate to generalise but I reckon most of us don't have the patience or maybe the knowledge to train them properly. I think anyone who eats meat should see the animal being led to the slaughterhouse, and then decide for themselves. Also I don't think just cos I am a vegetarian and don't kill the animals for food makes it okay for me to ill treat them.
Phew what a way to start the day, got to get ready to run to work. Hope you all have a lovely day :)
Posted by: Uma | 01/25/2006
hi,
just checked out the "about me" section. very nice. can you tell us a bit more about your interests? I'm especially curious about the mathematical models and wood carvings.
Kia hau te ingoa,
max
Posted by: max | 01/25/2006
Yitzy : You have every right to criticize poor treatment of animals in India. But I for one will counter hypocrisy, when ever I see one. Would like to apologize not knowing you folks better. What stuck me was, dogs are not more important or less important than other life forms. Prevention of cruelty is not just for pet animals because they are in public, but other life forms as well. Would like to take back some of my harsh words, but it sounded like hypocrisy, coming from Americans. There is advertisement for fat free food for dogs and cats on TV, followed by advertisement for KFC ;).
FYI, in North East India you will not find street dogs, since they eat dogs there. So India is not a holy cow. Every civilization when it matures (I mean when they over come internal strife’s, external enemies, famine etc) has a choice, to look for a meaning for its existence and what good it can do to its surroundings. Indians made that choice a couple of thousand years’ back, to stop large scale meat consumption, not to invade other lands. India was not successful in all of this, but they did try. Mind you, it was not written in Hinduism/Buddhism that one has to be vegetarian. It was more of a social thing that got strongly tied to religion later. Americans have that choice today; they had it for the past 50 years. Yes, Being a Vegetarian gives you a right to talk about cruelty to animals. If you are non-vegetarians and you talk about cruelty. Its pure hypocrisy.
esmerelda : Again, my apologies for not knowing you folks better. Secondly, it’s not prejudice against your origin. But can you digest it, if I were sitting and eating KFC or a Big MaC and talk about cruelty to animals? Yes, I generalized, but was I prejudiced? No. Yitzy seemed quite objective and you sounded very angry to me. So I am sorry if I offended you.
Uma : Uma, criticism is acceptable if it comes from the right source. I have no illusions about India and where it stands. Here are some figures for you “Indian vegetarians, primarily lacto-vegetarians, are estimated to make up more than 70% of the world's vegetarians. They make up 20 to 30% of the population in India, while occasional meat-eaters make up another 30%”. If I were you, I will be more concerned about losing this 30% population to the popular trend of eating meat that people mistreating dogs.
Posted by: mr.Anonymous | 01/26/2006
Well,
Mr Anonymous's main argument is also mine.
On what basis is treatment of one set of animals more of a concertn compared to others?
Well, its not anyone's fault as such - the nature or the universe or god has made - Rules Of Conflict.
"Lion must die - if it does not kill the Goat."
"Goat must die - if it does not eat the grass"
Aren't these basic rules of life?
Goat is living, and so is Grass !
Life forms have been setup to conflict with one another - by God (or universe or world or call-it-what-you-may) itself.
EQUALITY does not exist in nature. But we humans actually seek it in life... perhaps becz we are more evolved and intelligent than other life forms.
We do not think twice before killing a mosquito :). Insignificant life - form?
As far as i know - there is no answer to these questions.
Nevertheless, i would still go with being a vegetarian as far as possible - although i am not one today.
Posted by: Hunk | 01/26/2006
Hunk : Equality does not exist in nature. You are right about the animal kingdom. The same conflicts that crossed your mind crossed the minds of Indians a few thousands years back and also mind of Greeks. If west cannot look up to the east, look inwards at Greeks. Greeks are founders of western civilization and here is what Pythogoras had to say
"As long as Man continues to be the ruthless destroyer of lower living beings he will never know health or peace. For as long as men massacre animals, they will kill each other. Indeed, he who sows the seed of murder and pain cannot reap joy and love."
I guess its a matter of equilibirium. Lion doesn't kill unless it is hungry and its life depends on that. No alternative. So also for all other species expect humans. we kill for pleasure and gratification. We have a choice, to be better and we choose to be animals still.
Posted by: Mr.Anonymous | 01/26/2006
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